Rev. Isaac Ugboaja is the Founder and General Overseer of Christian Life Gospel Assembly in Oke-afa, Isolo, Lagos. In this interview with ANTHONY AWUNOR, the Prophet who in 2012 prophesied that Dr. Goodluck Jonathan would not be re-elected President in 2015, speaks on the 2019 elections, the role of men of God in the country and the need for public servants to uphold the oath of office amongst other issues
Irrespective of who wins in the Presidential election, how would you assess the performance of President Muhammadu Buhari?
In my interview published in a national daily in 2016, I said that President Muhammadu Buhari’s performances would shock Nigerians. I don’t know whether you have forgotten. Nigerians have seen them all. As a human, I don’t judge somebody because leadership is not an easy affair. It is something that real people are called both spiritually and physically to undertake. When somebody is not called to lead people, it becomes a problem. Buhari has tried. He is human. As I said in that interview, my fear was his health; that if his health could improve, he could do more than what he was doing then. His health was a threat according to what I said then. When there was crisis concerning his health, a lot of people who were pretending to be defending the party, put spanner in the works.
Some people, including men of God, said they saw ominous signs concerning in the 2019 elections. What do you see happening?
You made mention of some men of God who saw ominous signs. Some men of God are the causes of some of the problems in Nigeria. And this is because the people in As Rock embrace liars. They can say everything they want to say to shake the heart of the poor masses who are suffering. But all the prophets of doom will give accounts of the dooms they predicted. Prophets of doom are part of the problems of this country. What is happening today is that prophets, pastors and heads of churches go to lobby or follow people in government, contrary to the injunction God gave us to take oath to lead. Nigeria made a pledge to be guided by God, but we pastors have broken the pledge. Our leaders are going to men of God to pray for them, not knowing that they are bringing calamity. There is nothing like war; they should sit down, shut their mouths and pray for the government. As recorded in the bible, prophets in Israel, like Prophets Elijah and Elisha, said “bring the trouble of the country to me, so that Nehemiah would know that there is a prophet in Israel.” Can’t the prophets of today defend Nigeria? Whatever happens, Nigeria will stand.
The fathers of the nation, who brought freedom for Nigeria, made the oaths of office and the National Pledge a very important part of the nation’s life. But are we respecting them and protecting the interests of this nation? Are the prophets protecting the interests of this nation? I am not against them, but the character of some of them is making me angry. When former President Umaru Yar’Adua was critically sick, some prophets told us he was dead, while some told us he was alive. We didn’t know who to believe. Now prophets are telling the leaders, ‘if you drop money, we pray for you.’ For me, what we want is the peace for the growing youths that will come forth to take over this country. All the vows and oaths they took in Aso Rock, before and now shall be accounted for. The rumours of further killings here and there are mere political propaganda. After the electioneering, the killings in parts of the country will go.
When a pastor leaves the pulpit and becomes a politician, it is the citizenry that suffer. Some pastors hobnob with politicians; following them about and carrying their briefcases. An Islamic religious leader will not do that. A Chief Iman will not do that. I have lived with them and I know them very well. The earlier generations of the leadership of this nation, including the Nnamdi Azikiwes and Tafawa Balewas ensured freedom of worship and the nation was at peace. That freedom of worship can never be thrown away. It is important that pastors amend their ways and help to advise the government very well.
Buhari or Atiku cannot stop the peace of this country in the name of elections. Heavens will not fall whatever the result of the Presidential election.
Do you mean that abuse of an oath taken before going into public office and abuse of the National Pledge have implications?
Yes, they have lots of implications. They have very deep consequences. If a Chief Magistrate in this country could take an oath and thereafter decide to engage in acts contrary to the oath, he should be punished because nobody is above the law. If Mr. President would take an oath that he would be guided by the constitution as well as uphold the peace and unity of the country, and then later allows a cabal to be disturbing the peace of the country, he will pay for it.
Governors, ministers, and other government officials who took oaths of office, should all go back to the pledges they made and rededicate themselves to the service of the nation. The pledges we make, but don’t keep, are affecting us as a nation, because the elders that instituted the vows, didn’t go against them. Nigerians have denied the oath and also the fear of God, and we pastors have refused to tell them the truth.
Over the years the South Eastern part of Nigeria has been crying marginalisation. Is marginalisation enough reason to demand for the Biafra? And, will the grievances be an issue in the 2019 elections?
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A tree cannot make a forest. Nigeria is greater than any one man. I am from the South-east. The continued cry of marginalisation by the south-easterners is the product of a mistake of the government and the leaders from the area. The South-east leaders at the early stage did not stand up to be settled. Leaders from south-south and north did so. The militant groups from South-south, led by Asari Dokubo and others, were settled. But the South-easterners were not settled. The elders of the South-east should have liaised with the leaders of other regions to ask what they want so that they too can be settled in the interest of fairness and peace.
The agenda for Biafra is not ripe for now. Our governors have never called themselves together to listen to the agitators to know what exactly they want and what they lost, especially during the war that they want consolation and compensation for. Do we still remember that they are a people that lost over four million souls during the civil war? That bitterness of losing parents, brothers, uncles, aunties and sisters, is still in their minds. The people agitating now are small boys and grandchildren of the Biafran era. They should be brought close and consoled.
Condemning and abusing them is not the solution. Chief Ralph Uwazuruike started the agitation, but I admire his style as a good politician who respects the elders. If you see people in government, you don’t talk to them anyhow. Power is destructive and you have to save your life, your family and get what you want. I believe he is no more talking and has become a kind of ‘saint’. Let the young boys go to him, ask him what to do and take a few pieces of advice from him.
Do you see either Buhari or Atiku as the ‘messiah’ or leader that could take the country out of the woods?
A good leader or bad leader can do what is right only if God is with him. If God is not with a leader, there will be problems. If God has finished with these two, none of them will be what you called the ‘messiah.’ If God has not finished with one of them, he can be the ‘messiah’ tomorrow. That a leader is not meeting up today does not mean that God cannot bring somebody that would change him and give him the right advice tomorrow. All leaders of Nigeria love to be President. Our problem is advisers. Buhari and Atiku are brothers. All the people that want to kill themselves should know they are brothers. Let us be quiet and watch. A ‘messiah’ is coming out of the two.
Recently, you took to television evangelism. Tell us more about this. Why did you start it and what do you intend to achieve?
What I see on television is making me to shed tears. I will like to say to the church and our fellow ministers on TV that I may not be the best pastor. However, with my Promise Life Television Ministry, I want to show the world that there is need for truth. There are many things that we are not hearing. Our people have adopted the American backsliding character. They preach that everybody has to pay tithes even if they are homosexuals, fraudsters, ritualists and occultists. To them, who you are or your character doesn’t matter. I have to show that there are still real pastors. I am here to give people that real impression that not every pastor is counterfeit. I want to bring the truth. That is my mission of coming to televangelism. I am not coming to show that I am a vibrant or knowledgeable pastor.
I am coming to preach the word in a way that if you are a pastor and you have a university, you use it to help the poor and government, rather than exploit them. I want to show the world that pastors need to reduce the fees they charge people. Some pastors have widows with many children and none is able to go to school, but the same church has universities, secondary and nursery schools. But the widow will go out and mess up themselves. They still come to church and pay their tithes. Pastors should know that they owe protection and support to those they collect tithe from. In my 27 years of preaching, I have never carried a member to the mortuary or graveyard. That is my covenant with God. So at times, I fear what people are doing. I am even overdue to have programmes on television.
But, ironically, despite the proliferation of churches and increase in activities of both the Christian and Islamic religions, the ills of the society seem to be on the rise. Why is it so?
It depends on pastors. The whole problems lie with pastors and leaders. If you are an honest pastor, your members would know. Those very close to you would know. The bible said by their fruits we shall know them. Going on TV depends on somebody’s motive. There are people who want to make money, friends, contacts or show that they have arrived. My Promise Life ministry is under the umbrella of Christian Life Gospel Assembly. It is not for prosperity, but for salvation and deliverance. Prosperity is not salvation. But people make prosperity to look like salvation, but it is not.
As a religious leader what is your advice to the youths, INEC, politicians and the general public on the 2019 elections?
All the political parties should caution their leaders and stop using hate speech, so that they will not provoke the youths. If they provoke the youths, it will take us time to calm them down. However, after the era of Atiku and Buhari, Nigeria will be different because the youths are coming. After this regime, there will be general agreement. The whole Nigeria will agree together to bring a youth and nobody will sponsor that youth, but God. It does not matter what religion he belongs to. If God decides to rule a nation, He can use anybody.
A lot of people believe that a President of Igbo origin will go a long way to pacify the South-easterners who are alleging marginalisation. How soon do you see that happening?
Any time Igbo people want to agree on one thing, they will break into factions; Ohaneze will fall into two and fault-finders will come. It is painful that we are being mocked by Yorubas and Hausas. Igbos are not together and it is caused by our elders and leaders, because they will never trust each other. The youths will come up and that will solve the problem. I love Yoruba because they empower their brothers, making them millionaires just like the Hausas. For Igbos, they will not trust each other, yet they are the most religious.
